Reply With QuoteWhy don't you like cartridges? You should try Nespresso IMO. Really convenient to use and very good quality espresso(s).
Hi all, advice needed...
I've somehow really got into coffee lately - nothing fancy - just instant coffee but i drink lots of it and always black/no sugar. I always pop into starbucks / costa when passing and i love espresso's.
I obviously prefer the coffee from the starbucks to the instant stuff i use at home, but i know nothing of coffee, so here's my questions;
1) is there a machine i can buy to make black coffee and also espresso's just like i buy from starbucks / costa (no budget in mind, i dont want a cartidge machine i.e. tazzimo)
2) i always order a "double espresso" and i love it, but i'm not entirely sure how it's different to a single espresso, and i dont actually even know what it is - it's just concentrated coffee in a shot, right? I have mine black "as is" but i see others have theirs with froth - what's that?
3) can the coffee experts recommend a particular brand of beans that a starter like me could enjoy with my new coffee machine?
Thanks!
Why don't you like cartridges? You should try Nespresso IMO. Really convenient to use and very good quality espresso(s).
I just dont trust what goes into them, and all i'd ever drink would be the black coffe rather than any of the fancy latte drinks etc... Also i dont want to be tied into a particular system...
But if you do please please please recycle the cartridges. The waste of all that aluminium going in to landfill every week makes me shudder.
There are plenty of bean to cup machines out there. We've had a Gaggia one for ages and whilst it was a bit of an extravagance initially if it broke down completely tomorrow it would get replaced the same day!
Beans - depends what you like coffee wise. I like it strong so none of this Blue Mountain stuff for me! Actually we tried it in Jamaica and whilst quite pleasant it was a bit, well weak. I only tend to get stuff from high st outlets, Whittards etc and their stronger stuff is quite acceptable. Santos and Java etc.
I'd imagine its much like alcohol and chocolate and that if you get really into it there is a whole new world out there!
By no means an expert but my 2 cents would say try one of the stone top expresso makers as they are a relativily cheap way into it all but you still choose your own bean.
Also I think an expresso with a bit if froth is a macchiato, but I am sure someone will be along soon to confirm or correct that.
^It is indeed a macchiato when served with milk. Or a flat white if served with milk and froth.
I'm jumping in on this thread, because I'm in the same boat, know nothing about coffee and I don't really like expresso, but have kinda decided I need a Nespresso.Originally Posted by Marios
Don't laugh but I like the "Carte Noir" or "Kenco Brazilian" type strongish instant coffee. LIke an occasional latte or capuccino too.
Any advice on a cartridge system (I'm lazy) for "broadening my coffee horizons".
Also , there are loads of Nespresso models, any recommendations.
i think the espresso's are great for what they are!
OP the nespresso will ONLY do espresso shots (will only generally do lattes etc on the higher end models or with extra equipment)
On the cost side of things I don't think nespresso is exorbitant and for the ease of use, clean up and most importantly taste thinks its a super little system!
(oh and i think they have got £40 towards the pods which purchase of any machine atm http://www.johnlewis.com/231741500/Product.aspx )
^I've bought four Nespresso machines over the last few years (for different houses) and the latest is the nicest, most compact, easiest to use and the cheapest:
http://www.nespresso.com/uk/en/product/u-krups-white
Highly recommended!
I have a dolce gusto and a delonghi coffee maker but have just bought one of these
http://www.bialetti.com/coffee/moka/
Which is a really cool little bit of kit,authentic strong coffee.
Used it for a few months before resorting to Nespresso. Excellent piece of kit indeed, albeit not so easy to use like Nespresso of course.
yeah saw loads of these in Rome when I was there a few weeks back in loads of funky colours too! Got a plain one up in the loft somewhere - think i didn't get on with it for some reason just can't remember why anymore...
I can't help a lot with specific models as went "bean-to-cup" years ago, but having been through various coffee devices this may help a little -
Moka (stove top) - very strong coffee, no "crema" - is what almost every Italian drinks at home on his way to buy his first cup of espresso
Espresso machine - don't bother unless very keen - the level of mess/bother/practice isn't worth it in my opinion for the odd cup of coffee
Bean to Cup - have had Gaggia & Jura both provide push button coffee but try before you buy as some of the cheaper models don't seem to deliver hot coffee.
Nespresso - annoyingly (if have just spent 600 on a Bean to Cup machine) good - limited in drinks & don't like the idea of buying capsules mail order (unless pop into Selfridges) 50p a cup seems expensive but best you will make on a 200 machine without a lot of practice. At about 20-30p per cup for beans (15-20 gr per cup) would have to use about 1500 cups to pay for itself vs a 600 bean to cup machine. So don't dismiss without at least having a demo somewhere (although keeping a stock of the capsules must be a hassle).
Now let me see...
Bought an espresso machine, had a French Press jug, had to try the Aeropress and of course the old fashioned Mocha Stove top...
...but you know what?
I love my basic Nespresso machine!
I don't care that aficionados can spend an hour lovingly grinding a freshly home roasted bean to the perfect dimensions to work their Dibnah magic on hissing & spitting wondrous machines...
I don't care that bulk buying tins of pre-ground Illy coffee from the supermarket costs pennies per cup...
I love the simplicity of Nespresso
I love & can actually distinguish the various blends of Nespresso
I love the convenience.
I can live with the "expense" as I actually enjoy my coffee more
I can live with the 'environmental waste', as actually I only buy/use as much coffee as I need, and the used capsules are collected when the next delivery arrives!
Particularly enjoying the current variations of Coconut & Macadamia - Hazelnut not so bothered about.
Time for a coffee methinks
aeropress. job done. perfect for your needs and will save you enough money to buy a decent watch over a half decent machine. or failing that, just get a dripper. get a subscription to monmouth for the beans as chrissy pressy. then all you need is a good basic burr grinder. whatever you do, dont buy any of that cartridge shit. its for suckers. polaroid anyone?
Last edited by seikopath; 4th December 2012 at 00:18.
Good luck everybody. Have a good one.
Just buy a stove top , add some Talyors hot lava java , job done :).
My brother has a £1800 JURA machine at work. Bought used on eBay for less than £100
It depends how deeply you would like to get into coffee and the making of it.
Currently I have a Gaggia Classic which is more than enough to make great espresso shots.
One of the most important factors of coffee making is the grind. Also there is a massive difference between supermarket bought coffee and freshly roasted.
If your looking for a machine then Gaggia Classic or slightly more expensive, the Rancilio Silva are both fantastic machines. But as mentioned going down this rout would really lend itself to freshly roasted beans in which a grinder capable of grinding fine enough for espresso.
Double espresso in my case would consist of 18g of coffee. A double espresso is just two single shots in one.
Anyway good luck in finding your machine.
I'd start with a stove-top Moca pot like a Bialetti. I've still got mine that I bought as an introduction to the world of 'decent' home coffee about 15 years ago, and bar a seal change a couple of times, it's still going strong. If you like cappuccinos then you could also buy a stove-top milk frother to go with it. This way you haven't laid out too much cash and you can experiment at home with various ground beans, or even buy a cheap grinder and try different beans that are out there. You might find though, like I did, that you want to have a more authentic experience after a while, and for that you will probably end up purchasing some combination of device(s) that let you make the espresso-based drinks and possibly grind the beans at home.
Personally I don't see the appeal of cartridge machines. They are the next step up for instant coffee drinkers who want something a bit posher - a bit like someone moving from drinking meths to alcohol handwash. At least it won't make you blind, but is it really any better a product at the end of the day? Most meths/instant coffee drinkers are just after the drug effect so wouldn't have a clue anyway.
Bean-to-cup machines are possibly a good way forward if you are a committed coffee lover, but they are expensive and take up a lot of space. You mentioned that you weren't sure what constituted a double espresso, which I find a bit puzzling, so perhaps the stove-top is the best introduction for you?
FWIW I use a La Pavoni Europiccola with a Gaggia MM burr grinder (the grinder could do with an upgrade). I get my beans from www.hasbean.co.uk and have been happy with this combination for about 5-6 years now. I also work in the NHS and turn down about 20 cups of shitty instant a day and am proud of it.
A problem with most of these is the aluminium construction which (depending on water hardness) can taint the coffee and lead to corrosion. (Confirmed by comments of an Italian relative.)
I've got a couple of similar stainless stove-top coffee makers which don't have this drawback (these got a 'thumbs up').
Out of interest, do these work on induction hobs???
I was in Waitrose a couple of days ago and noticed that they now sell capsules to use in Nespresso machines, if anybody is interested.
I have a Nespresso and an Aeropress, which covers just about any requirement. The Nespresso has the milk frother attachment and produces great espresso's, latte or cappuccino as the mood takes me. My daughter is particularly fond of hot chocolate made with Green and Blacks chocolate and frothy milk from the machine.
Regards
Ian
Although no trees were harmed during the creation of this post, a large number of electrons were greatly inconvenienced.
Yes, they do.
My Bialetti is stainless rather than aluminium construction too. A bit more substantial than the alu ones and I'd trust an Italian to tell me how to make good coffee every day of the week!
I use a gas hob, so not certain, but I don't think so. Just tried a magnet and it doesn't stick to coffee pot which I think indicates it won't work?
Edit: Just saw the post above so stand corrected - perhaps mine is a different steel?
Get an Aeropress. All this talk of 'I'd start with...' makes me chuckle. I'd finish with one too. I bought a lovely 50's Diennes burr grinder on ebay too, and rarely use it. It's just not worth the hassle. I want to drink the stuff, not p1ss about with clobber. Just get some decent ground coffee, keep it in the fridge, and play with amounts, brew times etc. That way, you won't have spent a fortune, and you'll still be getting very good coffee. The law of diminishing returns works here, and the Aeropress makes a very good cup of coffee.
Once you have a machine I have had great service from here: www.anothercoffee.co.uk using a stove top machine.
...and the chocolate is beautiful.
No connection blah blah
Scouter
Mine does, but it is quite an old one and not alu. I think that's the difference?
And some Googling produces:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0009Q1DS...SIN=B0009Q1DSS
Last edited by j0hnbarker; 4th December 2012 at 10:50.
What he said!
For an outlay of £25.ish you've got the maker and enough change to buy some ground espresso coffee!
I've got one of these and am very happy. Cheap bean to cup option if you're not worried about espressos.
I have never been too fussed about coffee but once I tried Nespresso, I knew I would never drink anything else.
The capsules aren't overly expensive and for the ease of use I feel they are worth every penny, perfect if you like an expresso or just add heated milk for the latte!
For decent home made coffee a moka pot or aeropress machine along with freshly ground beans is a great place to start. The coffee from the likes of http://www.hasbean.co.uk/ or http://www.thecoffeehopper.com/ will be in a different league to the supermarket offerings. Coffee beans left in the open will start to go stale after a few weeks and ground coffee deteriorates after about half an hour. I once bought a bag of beans from Starbucks and the roasting date on the bag was four months old....
After a while you may want to grind your own beans and with good reason - the grind is probably the most important aspect of achieving great coffee. For a good first grinder the Porlex hand grinder gets great reviews and can be had for about £30. For a good electric grinder I'd be wary of spending less than £150. My first grinder was a Dualit machine from Amazon reduced from £140 to £80 and it was incapable of grinding fine enough for espresso. Cheaper grinders also have smaller motors and to make up for the lack of torque they spin at higher rpm's which in turn burns the grinds and makes for bitter coffee. I ended up investing almost £300 on a Eureka Mignon grinder for my espresso and keep the Dualit one for the rare occasions when I fire up the moka pot.
I have no experience of any of the capsule machines so I won't comment on them but some people love them and I can see the attraction of the convenience they offer. A friend of mine has a £800 bean to cup machine and whilst it makes consistent, hassle free coffee, the espresso it produces is no better than that from a £20 moka pot.
My machine is a Gaggia Classic with PID mod (fancy temp control) and I love the preparation that goes into making a good espresso and the satisfaction of having made the perfect shot. I also have it on a timer switch so the machine turns on 20 minutes before I get up in the morning and I don't have to wait for it to warm up. After over three years with my machine I'd say about 60% of my shots are perfect, 20% are good and the other 20% are a bit crap but the even crap ones are still better than anything from Costa or Starbucks etc.
Heres a pic of all the espresso based drinks for the op -
^ Excellent diagram ^
I'm going to print a copy and take it with me next time I visit a high street coffee shop, as when I inevitably end up with a latte instead of a cappuccino, I can point to the diagram and show the 1/3 espresso/steamed milk/froth representation!
They won't understand it. What you need is the same pictures, but with Polish words.
HTH.
Regards
Ian
Although no trees were harmed during the creation of this post, a large number of electrons were greatly inconvenienced.
waw - thanks for all the replies - this is exactly the sort of info I needed!
I will follow the links and do some reading and get back to you all with my further questions!
Amazon have a good deal on the Baby Gaggia at the moment. http://www.amazon.co.uk/Gaggia-74820...4641789&sr=8-1
Fantastic, and quite correct!
Excellent diagram people could learn a lot from this!Heres a pic of all the espresso based drinks for the op -
Nespresso all the way.
In regards the machines- they all do the same thing and so it boils down to the design you like the look of best. I own a krups citiz. My favourite thing in the kitchen by a country mile
Gaggia not what they once were, now owned by Philips.
Last edited by langtoft lad; 5th December 2012 at 01:46. Reason: Forgot the quote
This is my thoughts and experience with coffee machines .
1)I've had a DeLonghi Magnifica for about 3 years now . It's a bean to cup machine with the added benefit of making fantastic Cappuccinos with a press of a button or Espresso .It's around £500 mark . I know it's sounds expensive , but if you have 1 cup of Starbucks a day at £3 , the machine will soon pay for itself ;) .
2)This model has the option of extra mild straight trough to extra strong taste which is roughly a 'double shot' Espresso in strength .The foam is formed as the water is forced trough the coffee under high pressure . Also the ground can be adjusted to vary the consistency of the coffee .
3)I use a Starbuck blend coffee bean sold in Costcos for £5-6 a bag of 750g or 1kg (?) , or you can buy your favourite coffee beans from Starbucks .
Hope this helps .
I use (depending on where I am and the time of day) one of three things to make my coffee - a stovetop pot first thing in the morning, an aeropress at work and (if I can be faffed) my basic old Gaggia of an evening.
You really don't need to spend any more than a stovetop pot to get a good morning drink - I've got the routine down perfect such that I can do it all half-asleep while making the wife a tea and the child a bottle :)
If you are able to grind your own beans then Starbucks is the last place to buy from. Seriously, buy some freshly roasted beans from a local roaster or try some of the offerings from the links mentioned in this thread. I know its fashionable to bash them and I don't want to risk sounding like a coffee snob, but Starbucks is to fresh coffee what McDonalds is to prime beef...
Point taken . I think we like the coffee beans we get used to however , i will try to buy some from an independent source when I come across one .
Thanks for all the advice - Father Christmas brought me a Gaggia Baby, and it's fantastic!
I've used it with some standard off the shelf M&S coffe ground that the missus bought to get me going, and it tastes every bit the costa / starbucks eapresso that i have come to love!
Cant wait to experiment with different coffees and perhaps get into doing my own grinding etc
If you're in London and have been dragged kicking and screaming to Camden Market, then call into the Camden Coffee Shop in Delancey Street if not just for the aroma of roasting coffee beans but to wonder at the ancient roasters and grinders that the owner, George has kept running for over over 50 years.
It's an absolute treasure.
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