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Thread: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

  1. #1
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    PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    They're both iconic classics designed by the late Gerald Genta. In my opinion unique and beautiful designs. They're similar in many ways, and yet very different.








  2. #2

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Classics! My favorite is the Nautilus

  3. #3
    Craftsman CharlieSocks's Avatar
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    8) 8) 8)
    It just doesn't get any better than that!

  4. #4
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Very nice comparison, both are great watches! To me, the Royal Oak is one of the greatest designs ever (NOT the ROO's! :blackeye: ), Some day...

    Thanks for sharing!

  5. #5

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    2 stunning watches interesting to see them side by side :shock: . the PP is my favourite, its the screws (which i assume don't actually screw anything?) that puts me off the AP. unfortunately I will not in the market for either for the foreseeable future :cry:

    If they are part of your collection you are a very lucky man 8)

  6. #6
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by rasputin10
    2 stunning watches interesting to see them side by side :shock: . the PP is my favourite, its the screws (which i assume don't actually screw anything?) that puts me off the AP. unfortunately I will not in the market for either for the foreseeable future :cry:

    If they are part of your collection you are a very lucky man 8)
    Yes they do: they screw the bezel. This link shows a (vintage) RO getting screwed.

  7. #7

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by Eddy C.
    Quote Originally Posted by rasputin10
    2 stunning watches interesting to see them side by side :shock: . the PP is my favourite, its the screws (which i assume don't actually screw anything?) that puts me off the AP. unfortunately I will not in the market for either for the foreseeable future :cry:

    If they are part of your collection you are a very lucky man 8)
    Yes they do: they screw the bezel. This link shows a (vintage) RO getting screwed.
    I stand corrected! I didnt think about them screwing from the back oo-er!! thanks for the link

  8. #8
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by rasputin10
    2 stunning watches interesting to see them side by side :shock: . the PP is my favourite, its the screws (which i assume don't actually screw anything?) that puts me off the AP. unfortunately I will not in the market for either for the foreseeable future :cry:

    If they are part of your collection you are a very lucky man 8)
    Thanks for the kind comments.
    The screws are actually holding everything together. :)

  9. #9
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    fantastic watches - that white dialled RO is on the top of my wishlist, actually tried it on at M&W yesterday flying home from Heathrow... priced better too... (but the sales women had really no idea what kind of watch she was selling.. so off putting).

    Congratulations if you have them both in your collection!

  10. #10
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    The AP for me. A white date window on a non white dial just seems sloppy.

  11. #11
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by J-OL
    fantastic watches - that white dialled RO is on the top of my wishlist, actually tried it on at M&W yesterday flying home from Heathrow... priced better too... (but the sales women had really no idea what kind of watch she was selling.. so off putting).

    Congratulations if you have them both in your collection!
    Are you sure it wasn't the AP 15300?

  12. #12
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by Concub1ne
    The AP for me. A white date window on a non white dial just seems sloppy.
    It looks fine to me! A less 'sloppy' watch I could not imagine.

  13. #13

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Prefer the case, bracelet and dial on the PP, but the AP looks more pretty through the caseback.

    The PP styling is absolutely timeless.

  14. #14
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Gorgeous classic and I wouldn't mind wearing either of those two. When it comes to the AP RO I prefer the older model with the smaller hobnail pattern on the dial, but in the end... the 5711/1A is my favorite.
    Congrats with those two beauties... and compliments with the excellent taste :mrgreen:

  15. #15

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    This is nearly impossible to choose !
    After 30 years, they still look incredibly modern :shock:
    But i'd choose the nautilus, this blue dial is stunning

  16. #16

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    OP, so if it's A vs B, which is better? Both very nice, as if you didn't know!

  17. #17
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Lovely brands !!
    Top quality - (and PP pobably still a notch above in finish although both in the top triangle ?) however, in my case, like Rolex, there is currently nothing in PP that 'floats my boat'

    AP RO 15300 however is one of the most classy designs ever :lol:
    Thank goodness we all have different tastes. :lol:

  18. #18

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by pfff
    After 30 years, they still look incredibly modern :shock:
    I thought they both look a bit dated :|

    i've seen far far nicer PP's

  19. #19
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Two beauties, AP for me though.

  20. #20

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Two very nice, expensive and iconic watches.
    I would go for the PP.

  21. #21

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Me too, I have a soft spot for them, and wouldn't cope without a second hand.

  22. #22
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Would love to have both but the RO's waffle dial, esp in black, as you shine a light over it is magnificent and unrivalled.

  23. #23
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDude
    Me too, I have a soft spot for them, and wouldn't cope without a second hand.
    Which the replacement 15300 now has :wink:

  24. #24

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Oh well, getting there slowly, but still not quite arrived yet!

  25. #25
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDude
    OP, so if it's A vs B, which is better? Both very nice, as if you didn't know!
    It's impossible to choose. They're both equally well made and very comfortable. From a watchmakers point of view the movement in the AP is probably a bit more sophisticated.

  26. #26
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Now almost as good as a set of tits!

    I am pretty jealouse with you. Totally my taste! :drunken:

  27. #27

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by Kris77
    Quote Originally Posted by TheDude
    OP, so if it's A vs B, which is better? Both very nice, as if you didn't know!
    It's impossible to choose. They're both equally well made and very comfortable. From a watchmakers point of view the movement in the AP is probably a bit more sophisticated.
    In what respect?

  28. #28

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Two very iconic watches, congratulations on your choice.
    At first I was non to keen on the Nautilus range, but over the years they have grown on me.
    They both are slim pieces, but appear larger on the wrist.

  29. #29
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by ingenioren
    Quote Originally Posted by TheDude
    Me too, I have a soft spot for them, and wouldn't cope without a second hand.
    Which the replacement 15300 now has :wink:
    IMO the AP 15202 is in a different league compared to the AP 15300. The AP 15300 is a chunky version of the original Royal Oak design with a "downscaled" and cheaper but easier to service movement. The AP 15202 is much more expensive though.

  30. #30
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDude
    Quote Originally Posted by Kris77
    Quote Originally Posted by TheDude
    OP, so if it's A vs B, which is better? Both very nice, as if you didn't know!
    It's impossible to choose. They're both equally well made and very comfortable. From a watchmakers point of view the movement in the AP is probably a bit more sophisticated.
    In what respect?
    Some info:

    http://harrytan.sg/watches/AP-PP-Jumbos/APvPP-jumbo.htm
    http://forums.watchuseek.com/f2/jumbo-v ... 46212.html

  31. #31
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by Kris77
    Quote Originally Posted by J-OL
    fantastic watches - that white dialled RO is on the top of my wishlist, actually tried it on at M&W yesterday flying home from Heathrow... priced better too... (but the sales women had really no idea what kind of watch she was selling.. so off putting).

    Congratulations if you have them both in your collection!
    Are you sure it wasn't the AP 15300?
    Yes, stand corrected, off course it was... sorry
    still learning about those refs...

  32. #32

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Nautilus = yummie!

  33. #33

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Really nice 8)
    hard to pick just one but to me the AP is slightly ahead.
    I will never be in the choice so no need to blow my mind :wink:

  34. #34
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    You're reading my mind, Kris.

    Had lunch with a good WIS today and discussed the merits of the 5711 vs 15703 ROO Diver. Both a hefty price but the larger case and 5k+ saving is quite tempting...

    Unless you can find me a 5711 for a lot less than the 15.5k they seem to be fetching now :?

  35. #35
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by Kris77
    Quote Originally Posted by ingenioren
    Quote Originally Posted by TheDude
    Me too, I have a soft spot for them, and wouldn't cope without a second hand.
    Which the replacement 15300 now has :wink:
    IMO the AP 15202 is in a different league compared to the AP 15300. The AP 15300 is a chunky version of the original Royal Oak design with a "downscaled" and cheaper but easier to service movement. The AP 15202 is much more expensive though.

    To be honest, the 15300 has the AP 3120 inside, which is their flagship in-house Royal Oak movement, i don't think it's cheaper, it's just different as it has more power reserve, seconds, ceramic ball bearings and so on.

    I like them both, but preferred the seconds hand, so have the 15300 :D




    They look good on a strap as well!


  36. #36
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterM
    You're reading my mind, Kris.

    Had lunch with a good WIS today and discussed the merits of the 5711 vs 15703 ROO Diver. Both a hefty price but the larger case and 5k+ saving is quite tempting...

    Unless you can find me a 5711 for a lot less than the 15.5k they seem to be fetching now :?
    :mrgreen:
    Have you considered the AP 15202? It's just slightly more expensive than the ROO Diver but definitely worth it. I would'nt go diving with the 15202 though.

  37. #37
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by Kris77
    Have you considered the AP 15202?
    Unfortunately I suffer from "chubby bones" Kris, so feel more comfortable with a bigger case.


    :naka:

  38. #38
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Hi Argee,

    The movement in the AP 15202 is what watch freaks consider AP's flagship movement, actually one of the greatest automatics ever made. However the 3120 is easier and cheaper to service. The AP 15202 cost approximately 50% more than the AP 15300 so it's indeed more expensive and worth the extra IMO.

  39. #39
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Yeah, i do know, the movement inside the 15202 was created by JLC, under contract by AP, Patek and JLC, when it was finally completed, only AP used it, they then bought the movement in total off JLC, as well as all the tooling and designs, so now manufacture them in-house. It was the slimmest automatic, and the original movement in the original 1972 AP RO.

    I did have the option of the 15202 and 15300, but chose the 15300 as i just preferred the seconds hand, and the more robust movement, it's also not cheaper to service, as AP charge the same rates for both movements for their Periodic A servicing. The flagship movement for AP is the Grande Complications one, which i believe is manufactured by Renaud et Papi, the specialist movement manufacturers that AP own.

  40. #40
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by Argee1977
    Yeah, i do know, the movement inside the 15202 was created by JLC, under contract by AP, Patek and JLC, when it was finally completed, only AP used it, they then bought the movement in total off JLC, as well as all the tooling and designs, so now manufacture them in-house. It was the slimmest automatic, and the original movement in the original 1972 AP RO.

    I did have the option of the 15202 and 15300, but chose the 15300 as i just preferred the seconds hand, and the more robust movement, it's also not cheaper to service, as AP charge the same rates for both movements for their Periodic A servicing. The flagship movement for AP is the Grande Complications one, which i believe is manufactured by Renaud et Papi, the specialist movement manufacturers that AP own.
    You're right regarding the robustness of the 3120.

    Audemars Piguet have actually used the caliber from the AP 15202 as a base caliber in most of their complicated watches.

    The 15300 is very nice, enjoy it.

  41. #41

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by Kris77
    Hi Argee,

    The movement in the AP 15202 is what watch freaks consider AP's flagship movement, actually one of the greatest automatics ever made. However the 3120 is easier and cheaper to service. The AP 15202 cost approximately 50% more than the AP 15300 so it's indeed more expensive and worth the extra IMO.
    And the 15202 is supposed to be more comfortable than the 15300.

  42. #42
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterM
    Quote Originally Posted by Kris77
    Have you considered the AP 15202?
    Unfortunately I suffer from "chubby bones" Kris, so feel more comfortable with a bigger case.


    :naka:
    The ROO Diver is absolutely gorgeous and very tempting. It's the ultimate divers watch if you dare to go diving with it. :mrgreen:
    I'd like to try it on some day but I fear it'll look ridiculous on my skinny wrist. :(

    I guess it could be a temporary substitute for a PP 5711. :wink:

  43. #43

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    The Patek is streets ahead IMHO. It oozes class

  44. #44
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony-GB
    Quote Originally Posted by Kris77
    Hi Argee,

    The movement in the AP 15202 is what watch freaks consider AP's flagship movement, actually one of the greatest automatics ever made. However the 3120 is easier and cheaper to service. The AP 15202 cost approximately 50% more than the AP 15300 so it's indeed more expensive and worth the extra IMO.
    And the 15202 is supposed to be more comfortable than the 15300.
    I had a 15300 about a year ago and IMO the 15202 is much more comfortable. The 15202 is much lighter hence the thinner case and bracelet.

  45. #45

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by Kris77
    Quote Originally Posted by TheDude
    Quote Originally Posted by Kris77
    Quote Originally Posted by TheDude
    OP, so if it's A vs B, which is better? Both very nice, as if you didn't know!
    It's impossible to choose. They're both equally well made and very comfortable. From a watchmakers point of view the movement in the AP is probably a bit more sophisticated.
    In what respect?
    Some info:

    http://harrytan.sg/watches/AP-PP-Jumbos/APvPP-jumbo.htm
    http://forums.watchuseek.com/f2/jumbo-v ... 46212.html
    Maybe it's just me, but generally I'd prefer an in-house movement.

  46. #46
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    It is in-house, jlc were partially owned by ap at the time, and when they sold their share, they kept the design, tooling and equipment, so all of them are made at ap now, under the design they fully own.

  47. #47

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Hmmmmm.

  48. #48

    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    The only thing is just can't get when I look at these watches in this high class
    and I know it is a small thing but at these prices I think it is OK to look at the small things to.

    Why the log holes ???
    I think they a clear no go in this price range think they really destory the lines on the watch
    and I mean my JLC a 3k don't have them so it can be done.

    From what I have read and been told are many AP movements still today JLC based
    but what do we know??

  49. #49
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    Quote Originally Posted by Stensbjerg
    The only thing is just can't get when I look at these watches in this high class
    and I know it is a small thing but at these prices I think it is OK to look at the small things to.

    Why the log holes ???
    I think they a clear no go in this price range think they really destory the lines on the watch
    and I mean my JLC a 3k don't have them so it can be done.

    From what I have read and been told are many AP movements still today JLC based
    but what do we know??
    I think it's because the bracelet is sort of an integrated part of the watchcase.

  50. #50
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    Re: PP 5711 vs AP 15202

    The lug holes are because they use two screws to attach the bracelet to the case, it's also integrated to make it more secure. I feel that at this price, i'd be a bit miffed to find my bracelet attached by two springbars that you find on a 5 quid watch as well.

    Also, not many are JLC based anymore, a few of the older ones did use the JLC 889, modified to suit. This has now been replaced in almost all of them by the AP 3120, which is a fully in-house movement.

    The reason AP used so many JLC movement was quite simple, they owned 40% of JLC, and used JLC to design and manufacture the movements for the low to mid range watches in their range, they then used Renaud et Papi (owned by AP) for the high end complications, and also allowed others to use them, such as Richard Mille, Harry Winston and other high end makers.

    Since selling their 40% share in JLC, they have slowly phased out all JLC movements, bar the 2121 and the 2120 used as a base on others, that is because they own these movements in full, the design, the tooling, the manufacture process, etc.

    Personally, i think it's quite interesting to think that back in the 70s, companies like AP, Patek and JLC were so intertwined, remember that patek have also been known to use outsourced movements, although again, i believe they owned the designs for these, or do now?, it appears like it was quite a closeknit community, just look at the two watches in the original post, both designed by Genta, both very similar.

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