Reply With QuoteIf they represent the country then we expect them - I expect them - not to disgrace us. If they're going to do the naughties then perhaps they should disqualify themselves for selection.
A question pinched off the BBC website:
Chelsea footballer John Terry’s role as England captain has been questioned after allegations about his private life. Does a player's behaviour matter away from the stadium?
Sports minister Gerry Sutcliffe has said he wants talks with the FA over the suitability of Terry as England captain after allegations that he had an affair. But England boss Fabio Capello is in no rush to decide on John Terry's future as captain, BBC Sport understands.
The case comes after golfer Tiger Woods admitted a string of extra-marital affairs.
Do we expect too much of our sportsmen and women? Should their private lives be subject to public scrutiny? How important is their personal behaviour as role models? Do they have a responsibilty to their fans?
If they represent the country then we expect them - I expect them - not to disgrace us. If they're going to do the naughties then perhaps they should disqualify themselves for selection.
Should we not pick a team from the best talent available, capable of winning the world cup?Originally Posted by Glamdring
I'd rather the see the team lift the trophy over one that got knocked out in the first round because we took a team of role models.
Yes, they should be.
.
I think if one is representing one's country, one's behaviour
publicly & privately should stand up to scrutiny.
If you are in public office or a sportsman, you should be able
to have the people that pay your wages look into your eyes &
see that you are worth that salary, not only as a sportsman,
politician or banker, but as a person.
.
Personally, I'm fed up seeing footballers earning a £100k a week,
thinking that they are above the law, or commonplace moral standards.
Ashley Cole, roastings, John Terry and on and on ad infinitum.
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Jim.
This is my take - if you choose a career that means public exposure, then you have to accept your private life is out-the-window.
Soooo sportsmen (as well as actors, musicians, politicians, high-profile businessmen, etc) should conduct themselves with care to avoid such embarassment, in my opinion YES they should act as decent role models, after all a lot of youngsters look up to them and see what they do as "acceptable".
The main thing that John Terry did wrong was get caught.
I suspect many of those that are publicly clamouring for his head have been somewhat luckier in that regard.
As for a footballer being a role model...please! It just shows how skewed our values have become if we want our kids to be like footballers!
Hmm fame, loadsa money, fast cars, etc, etc - a lot of people would want that for their kids. Sad but true :wink:
So true and very very sad but I am saying this on a watch forum :roll:Hmm fame, loadsa money, fast cars, etc, etc - a lot of people would want that for their kids. Sad but true :wink:
Back to the topic though, I think they can do what they want but be prepared for the fall out.
How many other people are having affiars?
Whilst yes I think they should set an example, we have to be realistic these days.
No sportsmen is a Saint, especially today and whilst they "should" be setting an example, most of them are only human. Only people like Roger Federer appear inhuman in both skill and home life lol. What somebody does in their PRIVATE life is their own business as far as I'm concerned, how they perform in the public eye is what matters to me. On the pitch John Terry is an example to any aspiring footballer, same goes for Tiger Woods on the golf course, the only reason this topic even exists is because of the media. They want to sell stories and what's the best and cheapest way of making money doing it? By getting some juicy story about a famous person that people will want to read about because their own lives are boring. Same goes for the likes of Big Brother, can't come up with something original so they throw a load of people who will clash into a situation for our amusement.
To sum up, I don't care want anyone does in their private life, they are only human, what matters to me is their conduct in the public eye.
The question we should be asking at the moment is, should the media be allowed to keep probing peoples' lives to such an extent that right now, breaking a story like John Terry's, could jeopardise our chances to win the World Cup. All just so the papers can make some money and keep themselves in business, they have no interest what so ever in making sure sportsmen are role models and we shouldn't listen to their opinions on the matter either.
But at which point do you give up your career? Sportsmen, musicians and high-profile businessmen choose their career at a young age and without knowledge of possible future success, they work hard at it and very occasionally the odd one makes it to the top where they then gain the attention of the press. Should JT have decided to quit football as a teenager because one day he might become good at it?
Chris
Yes.
The problem is that once you are at Tiger Woods or John Terry level,
you really have no private life.
You therefore should perhaps consider that spending 10, 15 or 20 years
as a professional sportsman is a worthwhile way to live, knowing
that it will be for a limited number of years. When you retire, you can
live whatever sort of life you wish, dissolute or otherwise.
.
As I perhaps didn't explain clearly in my previous post: the public pays these
peoples' salaries, one way or another.
.
It is specious to say that John Terry should have given up football when he
was younger, because he was good at it. I'm sure most guys knew of excellent
players who never made the grade. When you make the grade, it is only fair
that certain qualities are expected of you.
.
BTW. Didn't Terry have a brush with the law when he was younger & Chelsea
stood by him.
.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/1750289.stm
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Jim.
But at which point do you give up your career? Sportsmen, musicians and high-profile businessmen choose their career at a young age and without knowledge of possible future success, they work hard at it and very occasionally the odd one makes it to the top where they then gain the attention of the press. Should JT have decided to quit football as a teenager because one day he might become good at it?
Chris
I think thats a little OT, people choose to get into the limelight, How often do we see Paul Scholes in the papers
Sorry Chris, don't quite follow your logic mate! Jim and Bruce have kindly written what i'm thinking :D
Ideally yes but I'll settle for them just living within the law, if they want to play away from home that's their business.
"I looked with pity not untinged with scorn upon these trivial-minded passers-by"
Paul Scholes is clearly a better man than Terry, although I don't think either would choose to have their private lives in the papers. Wasn't JT trying to pursue action against the paper not to publish the story.
JT is a born shit, but he is good at his job and should be allowed to do it at the highest level.
Ultimately the fans pay his salary, if they stop paying to see him play then he'll be out of a job, but it should be up to the fans to decide that, not Parliament.
Role models of/for fidelity?
As ambassadors in any sport you would wish them to be ideal - but that's Utopian and not representative of the national outlook. Children of all ages are spoon fed 'sexual freedom' from a very early age through every form of media; they are not taught fidelity, they are taught safe sex.
My personal opinion is that it is his business (even though I hope he feels shamed and full of remorse), he sold his soul when he was ever helpful to the press for coverage whilst climbing the ladder of success - now he tries to shut them up! The press never like that, ever.
Paul Scholes might be a better man, we don't know. As far as I am aware he has never courted the papers, Hello magazine and the like.
A few years ago we would have been saying Tiger was a better man than Faldo or any other golfer that got caught cheating?
We only know what we read, what goes on in these peoples lives is beyond me
I think thats a little OT, people choose to get into the limelight, How often do we see Paul Scholes in the papers[/quote]
Spot on. John Peel always preached never meet your heroes. If the England captain can behave as he sees fit and still stay in the job, then socially we are going to hell in a hand cart.
You reep what you sow. :|
It would be naive to want sportsmen to be whiter than white - they're clearly prone to the same failings as anh of us and presumably have far more in the way of means and opportunity to get up to mischief, alongside (generalisation coming) the risks that come from often not having much in the way of education and spending their adolescent years in an environment that must be pretty different from the usual school - university / first job route.
On the other hand, it would be preferable if they weren't total gits, which Terry's track record suggests he is. If we win the World Cup (and I doubt we will, but you never know), it would be good if the man collecting it wasn't an embarrassment.
When you accept the role of captain then you automatically accept that you are meant to be an example to others in the team, even if no-one beyond that. That is part of the job description and something that JT would have been aware of when he accepted the job. Should he still play in the england team - YES because he's one of the best players in his particular position, should he remain captain - NO because a big chunk of the respect he used to have has been lost. I think that he will know that himself and resign before he is pushed. Then he can concentrate on his football and help bring the World Cup back to where it belongs!
Graham
Absolutely. Point well made. If I won the lottery I'd probably behave quite badly as well. Even with the benefit of significant life experience, a decent upbringing and an appreciation of the value of money and sense of morality.
But sportsmen willingly offer themselves up to public scrutiny with their unending pursuit of media exposure, so they need to understand that fame brings with it responsibility.
Part of the problem seems to be the involvement of so-called "publicists" who whore their "clients" (usually the willing or unwilling recipient of some over-enthusiastic advances) around the gutter press selling their sordid story. Take them, and the seedier tabloids and those ghastly gossip magazines out of the equation and if there's nobody buying the story.....
Regards
Ian
Although no trees were harmed during the creation of this post, a large number of electrons were greatly inconvenienced.
In as far as staying within the law,yes.
Some sportsmen are intelligent,well behaved individuals....some of them would be difficult to tell apart from chimpanzees.
John Terry is a 1st class arse,but if you are the England manager given the choice of dumping John Terry or Wayne Bridge in a World Cup year then what do you think the choice is going to be?
Quite frankly i think ,for example,the expense fiddling politicians are a far greater disgrace than the extra-marital fiddling John Terry.....and do you really think that all previous England captains and other sporting icons have all been snowy white? Course not-the difference is they didn't get found out,whether through being more careful or being in a pre-paparrazi age.
Well if we weren't all so overly fascinated by the "off the park" antics of "celebs" there would be no story and no public disgrace (I use "we" in the general sense of the term meaning mankind before someone takes offence). So it's all our fault really. :)
I get the impression that someone like Stanley Matthews could have been a serial womaniser (I'm sure there were a few in the game then as now) and it wouldn't have got in the way of a glittering career. It's our attitudes that have changed. Why have we become so prudish in this supposedly enlightened age while at the time being obsessed with the misbehaviour of "celebs" in the press?
Dave
So let me get this right - A politician is lecturing on who is suitable for something he knows nothing about. Political hypocrisy in it's purest form.
if i were the politician i'd worry about the suitability of his work colleagues and all their shananagins before starting to lecture on morality . What a complete and utter twat.
It also seems that john terry is getting a worse press than gary glitter :D
I cant help thinking of a certain Prime Minister and his fondness for Curry :twisted:
I wont be filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed, I am not a number, I am a free man, my life is my own!!!
Be seeing you
Toodle pip
Griff.
I think Terry should go, not because he played away, but because he is mindbogglingly STUPID and shows apalling judgement.
First he takes tours around Stamford Bridge (Did really he think he'd never get caught?) then he pokes a team mates GF almost next door to his own home.
If I were in the same team as JT, he wouuld not survive the next training session.
All of his team mates must be thinking is he going to try it with my missus?
They should not be role models simply because they are in the lime light. The people who should be role models are those who earn our respect - therefore does JT deserve your respect - if no then he is not a role model!! End of.
As this point I was trying to think of a footballer worthy of my respect, but could not think of any :( perhaps Cruff - yep Cruff - always did the right thing, never cheated, never saw him get booked and was a truely great footballer.
Its crazy to suggest that my son should look up to any person as a possible role model, based purely on what is or is not reported in the news papers. True role models are hard working, honest people who try to make a contribution. Not some millionaire arsehole who is good at sport, nor some bloke who is good a music/acting, etc.
What is depressing is that time spent discussing whether or not Terry should be captain of England. Its hardly an important role is it :D and at the end of the day win or loose does it really matter. Terry was captain when MacClaren was Manager - and it was the manager that got the sack!! From what I can see the job of captain is to intro the players to the VIP, sing badly and carry a prezzy which he gives to the other captain - big deal!! He can also spit, shout, scream, swear at the ref (but then so can everyone else!!)
I personally do not give a toss if JT shagged a male Voice Choir (its not illegal), however what I find totally wrong is that people/corporations want to make money from it or try to use for there own advantage - ask yourself why SKY want to make such a big deal from it - is it because they own a couple of red top new papers :twisted: and no doubt are planning something to be aired just before the world cup starts - just to mess with us and to sell their product. One thing is certain - they ain't doing it to improve the morale code of the population. Not with tits on Page 3.
Also Terry never claimed to be a saint so why do you think he should be - unlike those arseholes in Westminster or the priesthood who claim the morale high ground but behave like the scum.
Finally everyone is focusing of Terry for what he did. What about the slapper (who is about to sell her story for £250K+), and her role in this - unless she was raped, taken advantage of, drugged, what's her excuse (apart from bad taste) ???? She knew exactly what she was doing as well as knowing Terry was married with 2 kids. However now she is also "famous" and rich so perhaps she should be a role model as well - just like Jordon :wink: .
As for the gov geting involved - If i was Terry I would tell him to FO, not his business, however once again the minister is not doing this as a selfless act, but inorder to exposure - why - because no one had ever heard of him until yesterday.
Come on guys get a grip - this is a non-story and not important. Let him and all the other cheating bastards and slappers live in their own cestpits without us having to watch it and without us throwing rocks. Above all DONT BELIEVE THE HYPE.
Andy
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
I totally agree with your comments 100%, But can anyone explain where they EARN their Wages please.
I earn my salary as do all of the rest of you, but these guy's work possibly 3 hours a week (1-2 Matches) ponce about training, and the odd bit of sponcership PR.
Work, they don't no the meaning of the word.
I live close to where a few of the Chelsea players live and train and have seen Terry in the nearby village, and he is one arrogant dim w****d t**t. I've no doubt you all recall the incident of him parking in a disabled parking bay, his relative's
recent shoplifting spree at a local supermarket..........It speaks volumes.
The man has no principles at all, he's like a great deal of these overpaid nonces, they believe they are above the the law and act accordingly.
As for winning the World Cup..........it won't make the slightest difference if he's captain or not, they don't stand a snowballs chance in hell of winning it.
As you will have gathered I'm not a fan of football :lol: :lol: :lol:
:roll:
Agree, and he looks bloody stupid too
I wont be filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed, I am not a number, I am a free man, my life is my own!!!
Be seeing you
Toodle pip
Griff.
A lot of footballers seem to get into similar positions, probably a combination of too much money and spare time.
The ones that don't spend their afternoons at golf are often lured to the racetrack or betting shop with the attendant problems of losing huge amounts of money a la Owen, Gillespie, Etherington or going back a bit Stan Bowles.
If they aren't interested in golf or betting they are always being pursued by nubile young sorts who want to bag a footballer.
What a life. :lol:
Cheers,
Neil.
They are human like all of us and they have weaknesses.
BUT
they are probably role models and that for me would be a pretty good reason to try harder to fight my weaknesses (especially when their face is everywhere advertising all kinds of shit :evil: ) .
Ultimately, who pays their wages..... the public (supporters through ticket & merch sales) and Sky subscribers and sponsors do!
IMO they are over paid anyway but with the above in mind, then yes they should, from time to time, use the one brain cell they have and engage their brain before their actions land them in court, on the front page of a news paper, in jail or whatever it might be that happens due to their own stupidity.
How many footballers over the past 12 months have been in the news for crashing their cars(Ferrari in a tunnel in Manchester anybody?), fighting in night clubs, drink driving, playing away from home etc. As has already been pointed out, they live their lives in the public eye and get paid silly amounts of money, not all of them but certainly in the premier league and those in the 1st division.
Best not get me started anyway, ooops too late.
It is still beyond my comprehension why or how a person kicking a bloody ball around can earn more than a surgeon / doctor. One saves lives and the other occassionally manages to string a couple of sentences together for a press conference after having a kick about for 90 minutes......... go figure :D :evil:
I never will understand what is so "great" about these individuals. I do of course acknowledge that there are some quite nice / decent footballers who do conduct themselves like civalized human beings and have more than one brain cell but they seem to be in the minority. I can't believe I have even bothered to contribute to this thread as anything football orientated generally makes me feel ill :D
Cheers
Paul
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