Submariner or Explorer II?

One day (not this year sadly), I'm going to get my Rolex. It's an itch that has to be scratched.

And up until now there's been only one, the Submariner Date.

But recently I've been more and more drawn to a black faced Explorer II. They seem to be cheaper second-hand (which isn't everything but it does help) and they're just a bit less, I don't know, obvious. The Sub is beautiful, and a classic, but a bit of a default choice.

Just wondered what peoples thoughts were, anyone chosen one over the other? Anyone had/got both?

In fact, just out of casual interest, forget the price, which would you choose?

http://www.prestige-watch.com/oro/images/214b.jpg

http://www.blowers-jewellers.co.uk/i...date_close.JPG

Sub Date for me - however., I hear where you are coming from in respect of the Exp. 2 & price.

For me the silver bezel kills it, but each to his own...........

As above, I don't like the fixed silver bezel. It'd be a GMT Master or a Sub for me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CPF

As above, I don't like the fixed silver bezel. It'd be a GMT Master or a Sub for me.

---

Yep +1

deano

I think: A sub is a sub is a sub!

Unless you travel a lot.

/john

.
I voted Exp2 but the Sub is going to win the Poll as it a popular model.

I just tend to prefer the lesser popular watches as a philosophy.

john

Disregarding price, I voted for the Sub. But I wouldn't pass up the chance of a Exp2 if I has the funds.

Dave

If you buy the Exp II you will always wonder if you should have bought the sub. Save a little bit more and go for the Sub, you won't regret it. I've got a mate who made the mistake of buying the "different" Exp II and has always regretted it and now yearns for the sub.

Of course, you may be different...........

The red second(?) hand and understated bezel on the E2 wins it for me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by abraxas

.
I voted Exp2 but the Sub is going to win the Poll as it a popular model.

I just tend to prefer the lesser popular watches as a philosophy.

john

---

I suspect you're right about the poll, I suppose I'm curious as to whether it's a Sub Date whitewash, or whether there are people who prefer the Explorer.

Regarding your second point, I tend to agree with you and that is a large part of the appeal.

I fear though that if I went that way, I'd end up wishing I had the Sub (as that has been my "grail", not in terms of unobtainability, but in terms of unaffordability), which is why I'm curious to see whether anyone has had (or got) both, or chosen one over the other, and what their thoughts are.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gurmot

If you buy the Exp II you will always wonder if you should have bought the sub. Save a little bit more and go for the Sub, you won't regret it. I've got a mate who made the mistake of buying the "different" Exp II and has always regretted it and now yearns for the sub.

Of course, you may be different...........

---

Precisely my thoughts! :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CommanderJameson

The red second(?) hand and understated bezel on the E2 wins it for me.

---

It's the GMT hand, but I quite agree with you, it gives the watch something.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CPF

As above, I don't like the fixed silver bezel. It'd be a GMT Master or a Sub for me.

---

I'm curious, why is a rotating bezel desirable on a GMT watch? Do you not just line the 24 hour hand up to the bezel and that's it?

(Not saying you're wrong at all, just curious as to what I may have overlooked).

Agree the GMT Master is a good third choice and combines good elements of both, but it's too close to the Sub for me, I'd have to have the Sub if going for that style.

My vote goes for the Sub, even though I decided not to buy one recently (came close, though). I`m not a fan of GMT watches at all; pointless unless you travel a lot.

My choice would be the non-date Sub, because it is slightly slimmer (suits my wrist better) and looks more symmetrical without the cyclops. Also a bit cheaper, discounts can be negotiated too.

Don`t rush into buying until you are sure which you prefer. Keep looking and trying on until you are happy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ari

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CPF

As above, I don't like the fixed silver bezel. It'd be a GMT Master or a Sub for me.

---

I'm curious, why is a rotating bezel desirable on a GMT watch? Do you not just line the 24 hour hand up to the bezel and that's it?

(Not saying you're wrong at all, just curious as to what I may have overlooked).

Agree the GMT Master is a good third choice and combines good elements of both, but it's too close to the Sub for me, I'd have to have the Sub if going for that style.

---

If I'm honest, I don't know. I guess you could set the 24hr hand to GMT and turn the bezel as you travel.. Not sure, though you'd figure out as you went along how to best use it to suit you. I just like the Pepsi bezel :P similar enough to the sub, whilst being different and having the option of the different bezels to shake things up should you wish.

Plus I like using bezels to time things like tea brewing, and don't really dig bezels the same colour as the case. That's why i don't like the explorer II, and it doesn't do much for me.

Have you seen the LRRP http://www.mkiiwatches.com?

Sub Date for me :wink:

Mainly cus I just prefer the look of it 8)

OP.

Not sure my reply will be too much help in terms of making a decision- you perhaps will need to consider both (over time).

I have Subs (Date and ND) and a white faced Exp 2 - and yet I'm still drawn to the black faced Exp 2 - it's highly likely I'll get one this year - the subs have the classic look, the Exp 2s wear better (thinner case, and smaller clasp) and are less of a cliche.

At times I actually prefer the brushed steel bezel of the Exp 2.

The GMT hand and ability to move hours back and forward without affecting the minutes is a real benefit, even if you only travel occasionally, and/or have family/friends overseas. However, the quick set date if the Sub is more convenient if you don't wear the watch all the time.

Re the water resistance, either should suffice, even if you do shallow diving.

As mentioned by others, the GMT 2 (ceramic, or 'original') are also relevant contenders, with similarities with both the ones you have suggested.

I really don't think that you can go wrong with either, and you'll always be drawn to the one that you don't get once you've got one. If it was a one and only Rolex then I have to admit that the cliche that is the Sub Date wins and therefore it got my vote.

I'd take a black Explorer over a Sub, but if it was a white Explorer I'd vote for the Sub. The 24h hand is a nice extra, but the watch has to look good as that's the main thing you do with it.

The fixed 24h bezel might annoy me if I was in the military and routinely needed to track three timezones. But if I needed to do that I wouldn't be messing about with a mechanical watch, let alone one costing 3k :)

sub date but if it had been an exolorer 1 :sunny: :sunny:

Really amazed that so far over a third of people would take the Explorer II! :shock:

I thought there'd be the odd one or two who thought like me, and all the sane ones would be ticking the Sub Date box. :D

I voted for the sub for no better reason that I don't like the skinny crown on the explorer :wink:

GMT II - no question.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CPF

As above, I don't like the fixed silver bezel. It'd be a GMT Master or a Sub for me.

---

This says it all :)

I'm for the Explorer II - a little less obviously Rolex, the GMT function is useful for traveling and I prefer the GMT bezel.

I also really like the white one.

Simon

Sub-date, and for a number of reasons! - I had an Exp II black face for a year, then flipped it, now wear a Sub-date and couldn't be happier

Reasons? - ok, 1) the red GMT hand drove me nuts, I just find it visually confusing to have the extra hand (applies to all GMT watches) - and personally I never use it, don't travel that much
2) the extra functionality of the sub bezel is useful - I'm using it to time cooking as I type this!
3) the bezel attracts dings like a magnet - well, they show marks very easily
4) the piddly crown just looks a bit small - note on the new one it's a fat triplock like the sub (it's the only 'improvement' IMHO)

I think it's a bit of an oddity all-round, the GMT II has the same functions, with a more useful bezel - the Exp II is 'rarer' than Subs basically because it costs nearly the same, but falls down in the areas above - and that's wht they're much cheaper second-hand.

the sub for me , but if i could choose a GMT II, I recently sold one on these forums and miss it immensely. The 24hr hand is so useful. It is so useful when you are abroad. I will get one again!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CPF

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ari

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CPF

As above, I don't like the fixed silver bezel. It'd be a GMT Master or a Sub for me.

---

I'm curious, why is a rotating bezel desirable on a GMT watch? Do you not just line the 24 hour hand up to the bezel and that's it?

(Not saying you're wrong at all, just curious as to what I may have overlooked).

Agree the GMT Master is a good third choice and combines good elements of both, but it's too close to the Sub for me, I'd have to have the Sub if going for that style.

---

If I'm honest, I don't know. I guess you could set the 24hr hand to GMT and turn the bezel as you travel.. Not sure, though you'd figure out as you went along how to best use it to suit you. I just like the Pepsi bezel :P similar enough to the sub, whilst being different and having the option of the different bezels to shake things up should you wish.

Plus I like using bezels to time things like tea brewing, and don't really dig bezels the same colour as the case. That's why i don't like the explorer II, and it doesn't do much for me.

Have you seen the LRRP http://www.mkiiwatches.com?

---

You set the 24 hour hand to your home time, so if your in the UK your GMT hand is the same as the main hands, when you go away lets say its 6 hours ahead, you pull out the crown and you can adjust JUST the hour hand (mins and seconds keep going so you dont loose time) so you wind that forward 6 hours, so now you have the GMT hand as home and main hands as local, this is the way I do it anyway.

I just dont like the GMT hand at all so it would be the sub date for me.
To be honest i'd rather have a non date sub (i looked at both and bought a non date)
Now if it was an Explorer I that would be a different thing but i just don't like the Explorer II

Another vote for Sub :)

Jim.

Explorer II for me.

It's a watch I'm hoping to get, and always gone for the white faced version, but the black dial is starting to appeal more and more.

It's a close call with both - they are the only Rolexes I'd consider buying - but the fact that the Explorer less common appeals to me, and I prefer the GMT bezel.

Gareth

Subdate but I too have been looking at the Explorer II's :wink:

Sub.

I also like the EXP II but prefer the white dial, looks better with the bezel IMO.

Sub date for me, I just don't seem to get bored of mine, although the Explorer almost looks like it's got less text, which is my only dislike of the Sub.

Just been to try one on out of interest at my local AD's. It's very nice, but don't like it with the white face personally.

If I do get one I think it will have to be a used one as I fear a new one would lose too much money if I decided I didn't like it enough and wanted to sell it. From what I've seen on S/C these don't seem to fetch more than £2,000 even if fairly new. (Anyone had any experience of selling one?)

If I went used and bought one with a white face, presumably the dial could be changed to black? And if so anyone have any idea how much this would normally cost?

I love the look of the black face explorer II as well. I also agree with the sentiment that its different from the sub but still a Rolex gives it a sort of extra attraction. I have tried using my Doxa GMT whilst traveling and TBH whilst I now find I like GMT watches I think that rotating 24 hr bezel's are useless IMHO(who wants to confuse themselves with 3 timezones done this way, not me thats for sure). The thing I find is that if it takes time to read then in the same amount of time I could have calculated the time zone offset in my head, thus rendering the GMT complication redundant. This is why the explorer II works for me because I could see myself just reading the GMT time straight of the bezel, in the same way that I find dive watches are better at timing most things then chronographs.

I've gone for the sub date, although I'd be happy with either. Tough decision. Good luck.

Rotating bezel for me was the winning factor.

Chris

Out of the those two, I voted for the sub, but if it was the white dialled Explorer II I'd have gone for that instead. But I'd not go for either if it was my money just because I really, really dislike that cyclops .. so I'd go for a ND sub or a SD.

both nice but i'd pick the sub date Ari. one thing that bugs me with the explorer is the small crown.

karl

As a (TT) sub-date owner, there's only one choice. :)

Paul

Explorer for me!

I have a white dial and it wears smaller than a Sub. I love the white dial but will pick up a black too at some point.

If i had to just have one Rolex it would be a GMT though...

Not a gmt 2...a GMT!

If you are set on a black dial then the sub. I think the ExpII really works well with the white dial especially as there are not many other models in the Rolex sports range with a white dial.

Was in the AD's yesterday and they currently have an Explorer II and a Sub Date.

Much as in a perverse way I want to prefer the Explorer II (cos it's a bit different) I know I'm always going to want a Sub Date, always have, always will.

So when the time comes (hopefully in a couple of months) I think it'll be the Sub Date that gets the nod (unless I spy an exceptional deal on a used black Exploroer II, although even then I've a feeling the Sub Date will still be hankered after and eventually got, so would just be putting off the inevitable I think).

I voted for the sub, but I can see the attraction of the Exp II, which I would think is less common. The sub is a classic though.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ari

In fact, just out of casual interest, forget the price, which would you choose?

---

I vote for a Sub Date or Non Date :)

Jim.

I like both, but if this is likely to be your own and only rolex, then wouldn't you always be lusting after a Sub? Hence my vote.

Going for the non-obvious choice is generally more my style, but not quite in this case - although I would defo look up a GMT II

Bezel kills the Exp 2 for me, so voted sub. To be honest the only Rolex I would actually buy is the Ceramic GMT II, a much better size than the Sub. Then there is the issue of the cyclops........dunno if I could live with it :banghead:

I'd go for the sub!

I've had & flipped both of those & it's the Sub I wish I'd kept.

The Expy II is a nice watch & I have looked at getting another but it would have to be the white face next time


Cheers

Dan

I have a few subs and the black face explorer II.

The ExpII was my first ever rolex - I look at many many watches and decided I wanted a Rolex - now which one?

The EXPII was the most unlike Rolex watch on the shelf - I had loved the rarer orange hadn one since i'd seen it in the dealers window as a kid - so finalyl decided it was going to be the EXPII and bought it new from my local dealer - I love it, always have always will - sometimes wish I'd have gone the whole hog and bought the Sea-Dweller as my first Rolex - but then maybe I wouldn't have a EXPII now.

On to the Subs - date sub - same cyclops as the EXPII - wears a little heavier - bracelet a little bigger clasps with divers extension - a lovely watch.

Non date - one of any all time favorite watches - clean non date crystal - but no date - - non chronometer version - much cleaner dial with two lines less writing - very nice.

Go for any of them - you shoudln't be disaapointed.

But note - likely to stop prodcution fo th Sub and non date beofre the EXPII - new sub model possibly next year - new Chonometer non date may last a littel longer. Seadweller prodution stopped already - if I was buying for the 1st tiem nowe - it would be my choice - then I would add the follwojgn when the prices come down a little - if they do.....

The nicest new evolution Riolex has to be the GMTIIC - a little more expensive - but still good prices second hand in very good condition - beautiful ceramic bezel and very accurante movement - bracelet clasp is absolutey fantastic and finally answers all the complaints (mostly non rolex owners have been having) Rolex/Rolex owners have been receiving for years - I've never had a problem with the old breacelet - but yes it is pressed metal and the new one is much better, and moves the Rolex bracelet from being second in terms of mechanism to my Omegas to vastly superior!

I prefer the explorer, but with the white face.

The sub is (dare I say it) a bit common.....